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162: Peloton Pledges $100 Million to Fight Racial Injustice plus our interview with Greg Hoskins & Crissie McDowell
Peloton puts their money where their mouth is pledging $100 million to fight racial injustice.
Peloton stocks hits a record high…and then hits it again.
The new summer collection seems to be showing signs of manufacturing flaws.
Jenn Sherman was on the Howard Stern Wrap-Up show.
Christine D’Ercole was interviewed on the website for American Academy of Orthopaedic Surgeons.
Travelweekly.com writes about how the spa and hotel industries are adapting for a post-COVID world.
Popsugar discusses the benefits of interval training.
Dr. Jenn Mann returns to talk about body image.
Whoop helped a PGA player figure out he had Coronavirus.
The latest Peloton wannabe looks like…a snail?
Fight Camp and plank punching. (No planks were harmed in the recording of this segment.)
Cody Rigsby is now doing meditations (as the Peloton Prophet predicted).
The next artist collaboration spotlights Dolly Parton.
The Pride collection has been restocked.
Updates on our upcoming Shannon Curtis online concert.
All-For-One rides are happening.
Peloton celebrated Juneteenth last week with classes from Chase Tucker, Tunde, and Chelsea Jackson Roberts.
We report on our progress with Best Fiends.
Watch the episode here:
Listen to the podcast here:
Peloton Pledges $100 Million to Fight Racial Injustice plus our interview with Greg Hoskins & Crissie McDowell
We’re recording this in the day. We don’t do that very often. It is off our rhythm.
I don’t even know what to say to you.
You hurt yourself.
I don’t exactly even know what I did to hurt myself. It’s something in my upper back. I’ve strained my lower back more times than I can count, but this is in my upper back right between my shoulder blades. It’s super extreme, I can’t lay down. I can’t turn my head either direction. It’s much better today. Yesterday was a mess.
I’m glad you’re starting to feel better. We had to stop at the store and get you special stuff. I did that after working in an overnight shift and I stopped on the way home, just to show what a great husband I am. I stopped after midnight and ran into the grocery store to get you.
I said, “Thank you.”
I know, I just want to make sure that everyone knows I’m awesome. What do you have in store for people this week?
All kinds of stuff. Peloton is all over the news. We’re going to talk about that. We’re going to talk about some things going on with the summer collection and stuff that the instructors are up to, and what’s going on with that crazy stock.
Before we get to all that, shameless plugs, don’t forget we’re available on Apple Podcasts, where you can go rate, review and subscribe. Be sure and subscribe, so you’ll never miss an episode. You can do that wherever you’re getting your podcasts. We should be available pretty much everywhere. You can get us on iHeart, Spotify, Google Play, Google Podcasts, all those places, you should be able to find us. Be sure and subscribe and we just pop up right in your phone like magic. You can find us on Facebook at Facebook.com/TheClipOut. While you’re there, like the page, join the group to help you stay up to date throughout the week. Let’s dig in, shall we?
Peloton had a special announcement this week from John Foley.
This was a pretty groundbreaking from a tech company no less. Peloton has committed to spending no less than $100 million over the next four years specifically to fight racial injustice and inequity in our world. That’s a pretty incredible for Peloton to do.
It’s nice to see them put their money where their mouth is, so to speak. It’s almost become trendy for organizations now glob on the thing. It’s nice to see some actual financial commitment as well instead of just a few hashtags.
Action speaks so much louder than words, as we tell the kids all the time.
Less hashtags, more cash tags.
All of their hourly wages for their workforce, that’s where they’re going to start. They are investing $60 million to increase hourly wages, effective July 1st. All North American and European based non-commissioned hourly team members are getting a $3 per hour pay increase. That brings the starting hourly rate at Peloton to $19 an hour.
Are they hiring?
Yes, they are, as a matter of fact. If you go to their webpage, they have all that. They have tons and tons of openings. They’re also going to invest $20 million in learning and development programs with a dedicated focus on hourly teammates. They’re going to continue to support the fight against systematic racism at the institutional level. They are investing $20 million in third party, nonprofit organizations dedicated to this cause. That’s going to continue the initiative they started by donating that $500,000 donation to the NAACP Legal Defense and Education fund. This goes beyond that. It’s another $20 million. They are also saying that they’re going to continue to democratize access to fitness and bring health and wellness to all communities. They are focused on making product and content more accessible to underserved communities via digital and connected fitness platforms. For years, it is our goal that at least 10% of the classes are streamed to and taken by members of these communities. I want to say thank you to Peloton. I think that’s incredible. I wish I worked for an organization that took any stance publicly, but especially one that is so strong. I think that’s incredible.
Hats off to them.
Peloton stock hits yet another record high.
Also another one today because this is from yesterday.
This is becoming a weekly story.
They hit three records this week, three daily in a row, it’s a record all-time highs. It hit a high of $57 per share. It has since gone back down, we’re at $55.65 but it has been on a roll. Analysts, including Stifel Nicolaus have been lauding Peloton. I believe it was Stifel that said that the target was $62 and now another company came out and said it was at $70. That’s the target price for Peloton. People are throwing money at it. Apparently, all these COVID rates are going up in all the states. Right now, it’s 28 states this morning. That means that people are throwing all their money in stocks that are impacted in a positive way by COVID and Peloton is raking it in.
It’s a shame that’s why, because I think it’s worth it regardless, but it’s nice to see people realizing the benefit of having the equipment in your own house.
I had somebody tell me that they felt like it was overvalued. I disagree with that. Personally, the stock market just doesn’t get Peloton. Whenever Peloton hit the stock market, I think it should’ve gone up then and it didn’t. It will be interesting to see what continues because this isn’t just a COVID company, either. This isn’t going to be one and done. What people are really responding to, I read in one of the articles, it said that specifically this fast forwarded the impact of Peloton by two to three years. It basically takes that forecast and pulls it in. It doesn’t mean that they’re not going to continue to have great growth. We just fast forward through it.
We’ve talked about this before, but I think it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy that nothing draws a crowd like a crowd. There are more people here, their friends and coworkers, talking about how they got a Peloton Bike or Tread and they love it. It’s going to become seen as a lot less of a play thing for the rich.
I agree, especially with Peloton focusing on that democratization of fitness. That’s going to help even more. I can’t even imagine how many people are going to have it in four years with that being the focus and that being where their mindset is. When Peloton decides to do something, they don’t do it small. They do it big. It will be very interesting to watch.
That’s the good news. Now, some less than good news, not awful, but just a little issue that we’ve been seeing.
I would agree. It’s not bad, but it’s just not awesome. The summer collection that was released at Peloton, I’ve been seeing a lot of complaints about this. The letters are peeling off, the ones that say, “Peloton,” particularly on the leggings of The Beyond Yoga set. I have seen multiple people post pictures where literally they took them out of the package and put them on, and by the end of the day, the letters came off. This isn’t a case where people have washed them and then dried them multiple times because sometimes that happens. This is a different thing. The good news is that Peloton understands that this is a problem. If you call customer service, the replacement will be sent. All you’ve got to do is send some pictures and be nice. Don’t be a jerk. They will help you out because they want you to be satisfied with your clothing selection. No need to be mean to people selling it.
Also if you have ran into this issue, it’s not just you and don’t be shy. Jenn Sherman was not on the Howard Stern Show proper, but on the Howard Stern Wrap-Up Show.
My understanding of that is that Howard Stern is not on that part.
I believe that’s how that works.
I don’t even understand.
They just have a lot of content to create and fill during the day. That’s one of the ways they do it is they have a post-show show.
On the post-show show, our beloved Jenn Sherman was on. Everybody was participating via Zoom. Obviously when you’re listening, you can only hear the radio content. If you go to Jenn’s Instagram page, you can see a picture of her on the Zoom with everybody.
Christine D’Ercole popped up on the website for the American Academy of Orthopedic Surgeons, which is at AAOS.org.
She talked all about exercise and self-care. This was an interview that she did, so there are lots of questions talking about how to deal with social distancing isolation, what recommendations are about that. She also was asked things about all these tribes that Peloton has, “Is there anything you notice about the tribes?” Christine gave her thoughts on that, so I thought it was interesting. They asked her about one of her saying which she says all the time, “Take a deep breath, drop your shoulders and your baggage.” “Do you think that part of the secret sauce of Peloton has to do with peers who are accountable to give permission to each other and to take care of ourselves?” She talks all about that and the secret sauce of Peloton. You definitely want to check that out.
I like the headline, “Famed Peloton Instructor Discusses Exercise and Self-care.”
They are all famed.
Travel Weekly had an interesting article about how hotels are transitioning to digital and touch-free offering.
That’s interesting. Some hotels had already been headed in this way. Obviously, there was the partnership between Westin and Peloton.
It never really seemed like it got tons of traction though.
If you’re a person who travels to Westins, you appreciate that and use it a lot. If you’re not going to those hotels, what else is there to talk about? To your point though, I haven’t seen a lot of other hotel chains latching on to that. I’ve seen a few. When we were in New York, the hotel that we stayed at which may have been a Westin now that I think about it, had pelotons in the actual open community center. What this article is saying that they expect that there’s going to be a lot more in-room demand for things like a Mirror and a Peloton, so you don’t even have to leave your room because you don’t want to go to the icky fitness center.
That’s a great area for a Mirror or Tonal to access because it doesn’t eat up any of the footprint of the room in the way a Peloton does. I’m not trying to argue against Peloton, but when you get to some of those hotels, especially in big cities like New York or San Francisco, they’re pretty tiny. To sneak a Bike into there might be difficult. To hang something on the wall and just have a little bit of clearance for the arms to come out, seems pretty achievable.
I would say even the Bike isn’t that much of a huge footprint, but they’re not going to build a sticker Tread in every room.
There’s no way you can put a Tread. It’s reserved for the suites, the penthouse.
They also talk in this article, which is fascinating about how spas are going to address this. One of the things that they’re thinking that is going to happen is people are going to be looking for things like a Hyperice, which is a self-massage tool. They think that there’s going to be a lot more of those that you can work out your own kinks that you get from working out when you get sore. I find that whole cycle fascinating. It will be interesting. Like with Peloton, I feel like this entire thing was already headed down this path, we’ve just fast forwarded.
I saw an article on a totally different website about one of the massage parlors trying to figure out touch-free happy endings. Good luck to you.
That will be interesting.
POP SUGAR had an article.
It was featuring an interview with Selena Samuela. She talks all about intervals. Selena, as you know, is one of our Tread instructors for Peloton. She talks all about intervals, why it’s so important to do intervals and how to work them into your workout. I like intervals because I genuinely believe they help so much with your speed, but they also help you with your endurance in a weird way, because it makes it makes your VO2 max, like it makes that ability longer. The threshold in which you can work out goes up over time. Because of that, your endurance is naturally going to be longer at a lower pace. If you’re working out at a lower pace, then you can do that longer, the more you amp up your actual VO2 max. People at home, I hope you understood. At any rate, I think that’s really cool. Also it’s nice to see one of our other Tread instructors being featured in a cool article by POP SUGAR.
Joining us Dr. Jenn Mann, Licensed Marriage, Family and Child Therapist and Sports Psychology Consultant. You may know her from VH1’s Couples Therapy with Dr. Jenn or VH1’s Family Therapy with Dr. Jenn, her long running radio show. She’s written four bestselling books including The Relationship Fix: Dr. Jenn’s 6-Step Guide to Improving Communication, Connection & Intimacy. Dr. Jenn, hi.
It’s great to see and hear you, guys.
It’s good to see you too. Thank you for joining us again.
What’s our topic this week?
We’re going to talk about body image. We’d like to know your thoughts, dr. Jenn, on how we can change from focusing on how we look to how we feel.
It is very important. There’s so much pressure in society now to look like some air-brushed fake Instagram model that probably doesn’t even look like what she looks like. In the ‘80s, it was one of those supermodels like Carol Alt or Christie Brinkley or one of those women who said, “I don’t even look like what I look like in the magazine.” It’s important first of all to have a reality check of what is a reasonable expectation given who you are, your level of health, your ability to work out, your ability to take care of yourself. If you are a new mom with a baby who’s working a job and is struggling to get on the treadmill, to expect yourself to look like some hard body, twenty-year-old, super model who their full-time job is to sit around and work out. You’re only going to feel terrible about yourself. I am all for positively embracing our bodies at all sizes and shapes. It’s very important that we are able to look at what’s good about our body, as well as what we’d like to improve about our body.
Sometimes people get misled with all of this body positivity, which I’m a huge fan of. I wrote my Doctoral dissertation all about eating disorders and weight loss without deprivation and dining habit, no more diets based on my dissertation. Sometimes people think that body acceptance means that we don’t work on improving our health, improving our bodies, being more fit, being healthier, that somehow you have to pick one or the other. You can embrace your body and say, “My body is beautiful at any size and any weight.” You can work on that and at the same time, work on improving it and being stronger and healthier and more flexible and have better endurance and all that great stuff. It’s not mutually exclusive. I also think that we’re working on not beating ourselves up before our imperfections is really key.
Many years ago, I had an eating disorder for about a decade and am completely recovered. I know a lot of people talk about in recovery for me. I don’t see it that way, because for me now, food is not an issue. Weight is not an issue. I’m very happy with myself and my body. I come to pride myself in any way but it is important. I know in my own journey, in order for me to get healthier, I had to embrace my body when I was a lot happy. I was about probably 50 pounds heavier than I am now. I had to learn to love and accept my body as it was, even though there were things about it that I wanted to change and wanted to be different. In order to do that, I had to be able to love my body, make choices out of love, not loathing, beating myself up. When we make decisions based on, “I hate myself. I hate my thighs. I hate the way I look,” we don’t tend to make healthy choices. We don’t tend to make loving choices. We don’t tend to make choices that we can sustain over periods of time and they feel crappy. They feel punitive and punishing and awful. Being able to embrace ourselves and instead make choices out of love.
It’s interesting because we get to talk to many people doing what we do here. We’ve talked to a lot of Peloton instructors and now Tonal instructors and employees. People lose sight of the fact that in so many ways, almost nobody is happy with how they look. Many of these instructors who you would think are the epitome of physical fitness, when you listen to their stories, they have struggled with their own interpretation of their physical appearance as well.
Kendall has been very open about her struggles in the past with eating disorders and body image and all that stuff. You look at her and you’re like, “You are gorgeous and fit and have such a crazy sexy body. How could you ever look at yourself like that?” Also our body criticisms aren’t necessarily based in facts or not necessarily based in reality. A lot of the time, we will take a lot of our anxiety, depression, and it gets projected onto our bodies. Sometimes it’s easier to focus on that than the other things that are far more painful. I remember one time in my private practice, in my therapy practice, talking to a woman who was certainly with an eating disorder and was so hating her body and obsessing about her body. I said to her, “If you weren’t obsessing about your thighs right now, what would you be thinking about?” She looked at me and she said, “I’d probably be thinking about killing myself.”When you’re in the low ranks, try to filter it down to a pretty specific range so you feel better about yourself. Click To Tweet
It spoke that a lot of times, it’s easier to think about those things than the things that are making us sad or the things that we’re struggling with, or childhood trauma that we haven’t dealt with or a marriage that sucks right now, or feeling like a failure as a parent. That it’s easier to struggle and to focus on this painful thing than that we’re almost used to. Society conditions us like it’s acceptable, unfortunately. I work hard to change this to call up your girlfriend and be like, “I hate my bod, I hate my arms. I hate this thing about me. They’ll chime in, “I hate mine too.” We connect, unfortunately, especially as women about being critical of our bodies. When I recovered, I stopped all of that. I told my friends, “I’m not going to talk about diets. I’m not going to talk about body criticisms. If you want to talk about that, I love you but I can’t participate. If you want to talk about it in terms of like, what’s helped you work past that, that I’m in. I’m not going to sit around and help you hate your body and I’m not going to hate mine.”
That spoke to me because when you said that it’s distracting you from things, I was thinking about how I think I do that a lot. Especially people who have dealt with childhood trauma or things from their past, they might be used to that constant stress, that constant drama that comes from whatever happened in their past. That might be a way to manufacture it within yourself instead of outside of yourself. I am fascinated.
It’s a way to continue the chaos that you grew up in. It’s a way to continue the self-loathing that you grew up with because if someone abused or you mistreated, then it teaches you to abuse and mistreat yourself. Hating your body is another way to do that. When I was having an eating disorder, it was a shitty decade for me in terms of my mental state. I was a competitive gymnast at the time. I had a very strict, hardcore coach, who did weigh ins and a lot of shaming and a lot of name calling and all that stuff. I internalized a lot of that. Then I used that same language she used towards me towards myself. I learned the way of self-loathing at a very early age. When I decided, “I can’t take this any longer,” during the course of that ten years of my eating disorder, my weight fluctuated by about 70 pounds. I’m not that tall. At a certain point, the best I can hope for is to be a “normal way” and just be obsessed all the time.
I came across a woman named Geneen Roth, who had a book called Breaking Free from Emotional Eating. I read that book and it was like a light bulb went off. A girlfriend of mine who had been struggling with these issues had turned me on to it. She said, “This has really helped me.” I read it and it is about learning to listen to your body, to eat when you’re hungry, to stop when you are satisfied. M app, No More Diets, is based on this philosophy, using what we call in eating disorder recovery world, the Hunger Scale, a scale from 0 to 10. Ten is the fullest you’ve ever been. Your stomach is going to explode. Zero is you’re about to think you’re so hungry. Five is neutral. Working on learning to eat when you are three, which is solidly hungry. A four is, “I think I might be hungry, but I’m not sure.” A two is your stomach is grumbling, you’re not feeling so great. A one is you’re feeling really sick. You’re not sure how much longer you can go on. On the other side of the scale after that five, a six is, “I can tell I have food in my stomach, but I’m not overly full.” Seven is, “I’m full.” Eight is, “I’m stuffed.” Nine is, “I’m in pain.”
What I teach people to do both in my private practice and in my No More Diets app is learn to eat when you’re a three. If you’re eating when you’re not hungry, you don’t know when to stop because you’re not feeding something physiological. You’re feeding something emotional. Food will never really do the job, so we can eat forever. To start to learn to eat when you’re a three, and to stop when you’re a five or six. You don’t need to be stuffed because that’s of uncomfortable, and it’s not what our bodies want. Our bodies want to feel comfortable. I always think of it this way. You eat a meal and then someone were to chase you down the block, could you still run?
What I realized in my own recovery was, first of all, I had to mourn the loss of I thought my body needed more food than it needs. If I’m really listening, it doesn’t need mass quantities. Also what I realized is that for me at the time, the negative self-talk, the obsessing about food in my body at best, it was a constant background noise. Even if I wasn’t thinking about it consciously in the forefront, it was always running through my head in the back, “How many calories had I eaten? How much exercise have I done? What would I eat at my next meal? Did I eat too much at my last meal?” It was constant. I was a pretty sick puppy but it was constant for me.
When I decided that I was going to make my recovery my number one priority, then everything changed. It was scary and it was hard. It was especially hard to trust the process of, “I’m not going to diet anymore. I’m not going to follow what someone else thinks I should eat. I’m going to trust my body that I haven’t trusted in a decade to serve me. I’m going to listen to it and I’m going to eat the foods it tells me to eat. I’m going to eat when I’m hungry and I ask for food, and stop when it’s satisfied.” It was terrifying for me. If I had took all the time that I had spent obsessing about food and my body and my own negative body image, I felt like I could have cured cancer. It was so much and constant.
When I made that shift, the first year was the most difficult. It was terrifying. It was scary. It was painful. I gained some weight. I lost some. I was all over the board. It took me a while to trust that and to ease into it. Once I did, it changed my life. It freed me in a way I never could have imagined. Food is not an issue for me at all now. I eat whatever I want. I don’t deprive myself of anything. Even though I’m vegan, I still eat cookies and ice cream and cake and all that stuff as you can see on my Stories. I never deprive myself of anything, and I listen. I honor my body. I also love fruits and vegetables and other wonderful, healthy food.
Thank you so much for joining us again. Until next time, where can people find you?
People can find me on social media, @DrJennMann or my website, DoctorJenn.com.
Thank you very much.
Transitioning back into the news stories. There’s a fascinating story about WHOOP, which we’ve talked about from time to time.
Do you remember a while back that I told you that WHOOP was doing this study on COVID? They had gathered all of these people who either had it or they’ve either been diagnosed with it or they had symptoms of it. They put all of this information together and they found that not for everybody, but for a lot of people, their respiratory rate went up significantly when they had COVID-19. The interesting thing is, I didn’t know this, your respiratory rate stays the same almost all the time when you sleep. Mine is pretty high apparently for my age, but it says that it’s personal. Everybody could be different, but mine is always between 17 and 17.4. Every great once in a while, I hit 17.5 but it’s dead on every single night.
What they started seeing with these COVID people is like, let’s just take my number, it would jump up to 19 overnight. That was this big indicator that you have COVID. Fast forward to a PGA player, which I believe was Rory McIlroy, I could be wrong. I couldn’t find the article quickly before we started recording, but I think it was Rory. He found out that he had it, or maybe he was talking about somebody else that did, but somebody within the PGA had it. They figured that out by looking at their Whoop data. They had read the same article that I read. They saw that their respiratory rate went up. They had already suspected they were getting COVID, immediately went to the doctor and got tested and sure enough, they had it. Because of that, the PGA Tour responded by buying a crap ton of them and giving them, a thousand of them, to the entire PGA Tour, the Korn Ferry Tour and the Champion Tour players, their caddies and the media and essential workers.
I do wonder with WHOOP, if you’ll start to see this long-term as they develop more and more data, if they’ll start to see like, “This thing indicates that you have the flu coming on, look into that or this thing indicates that you’ve got carpal tunnel, I don’t know, just whatever.” They can start cross-referencing those data points and send people notifications like on Facebook when somebody likes your picture. You’ll get like, “You might have the Rona. Go check it out.” It’s fascinating.
I know there are several of you that have thought about getting a WHOOP and you’re not sure about it. I admit that there have been moments that I’m like, “I’m paying too much for this thing.” When I read that, I’m like, “That’s cool.” I love that they can do that. I appreciate that tech. I personally am all in for at least for now. I included this next one for you, Tom.
It’s the futuristic one-wheeled exercise bike that redefines home fitness equipment, while simultaneously making you look like an idiot.
You look like you’re riding a giant snail.
If you always wanted to have a snail up your butt, here’s your opportunity. It looks like if someone from the 1900s invented an exercise bike or what they thought in the future would look like. It looks like those big, giant, one-wheeled bikes that you would see in the opening credits of Cheers or on the wall of a subway before they remodeled them all. I don’t know if this thing’s good or not, but it looks positively ridiculous.
I don’t know anything about it other than it’s ridiculous. I literally did nothing else than look at it and laugh. In the descriptions right next to it really briefly, it says, “It’s ergonomic, innovative and it’s known for its luxurious contemporary design that elegantly merges technology function and aesthetics.” I’m going to say we’re going to have to disagree. We’re going to have to agree to disagree. It’s called the Ciclotte. I call it the weird snail bike. Everybody was curious of your take on it. That’s why I included it.
Let’s check in on your little FightCamp journey. You’re pretty deep into that journey, pretty far down the Prospect Path.
I am still very much enjoying it. I completely decimated my punch count this week. That was exciting to me. I like watching the little ticker. I actually was watching it and sometimes especially on plank punches, you’d be surprised how hard it is to punch while you’re in a plank. It’s not easy.
How do you do that and not fall on your face?
That’s the challenge because you’ve got to keep yourself held up and it’s a lot of core happening.
I know people hated planks, but I never thought about punching one.
You don’t punch yourself. You try to punch the bag while in a plank. You’re planking it and then you pull an arm up and punch the bag. I found that I have very little power when I do that. I have to concentrate to actually punch the bag hard enough that it counts my punch. I got ticked off and I went down to my knees. I didn’t stay up on my feet. I totally cheated and went down to my knees so I can punch it. My whole point was that I had to come out of the plank position down to my knee, like a modified plank, so that I could keep up with my punch count. I was getting frustrated because I always go beyond my punch goal and it wasn’t registering my punches because I couldn’t get enough force in a plank.
Your punch count was bad, but your light tap count was just through the roof.
Unfortunately, there was no one counting that. By the end though, I had caught up because of my modified plank. I’m going to have to do some more planks to strengthen my core, so I can make those punches count throughout.
We should probably say people should watch this space in the not too distant future, we will have some more news regarding FightCamp coming your way. I think people will find that very interesting. In the meantime, if you would like to check out FightCamp yourself, you can go to JoinFightCamp.com.
If you purchase, don’t forget to say that The Clip Out sent you.
Cody Rigsby has entered the world of meditation.
Apparently, he ends his meditations with, “Bye boo.”
That seems fitting. We should also point out that the Peloton Prophet predicted this over a year ago.
We haven’t heard much from the Peloton Prophet lately, but they clearly still got it.
It’s also a good indicator that even when you think maybe they did get something wrong, they’re just not right yet. There’s a new artist series featuring Dolly Parton.
I am incredibly stoked about that. There is a whole thing that has to happen on Friday for me, I have to rearrange everything so that I can be there. By the way, in case we did not mention it, Jenn Mann will be celebrating her 200th ride on the Robin Arzon collaboration with Dolly Parton on Friday. That will be at 6:00 PM Eastern. I will definitely be there. On Wednesday, the 24th at 5:30 PM Eastern is going to be Flow with Kristin McGee. On Thursday, the 25th, Selena Samuela will be doing a Tread and Floor class.
Is it true that these will only be available on-demand from 9:00 to 5:00?
It is not true.
Would you say that they will always be available via live stream?
I would. Also, I am curious to see what songs Robin Arzon chooses. When I think Dolly Parton, I do not think Robin Arzon. I’m not saying there’s anything wrong with that. That’s not who I would have thought of. I am curious, I can’t picture. I get why she loves Dolly. Dolly is incredibly empowering, so it makes perfect sense to me. I’m just like, “I never even thought about what kind of class Robin Arzon is going to put together. I’m dying to see this playlist. I can’t wait.
Get your leggings of many colors ready for the Dolly Parton collaboration. The Pride collection was restocked.
They promised by mid-June, didn’t quite make it by the 15th, but they got it up this week. In case you missed it, it’s probably too late now, but there was a new hoodie that was introduced. I had to have it. In my defense, it was the only hoodie that I bought. I didn’t buy any of the summer collection. You need to give me credit for how much money I saved you. This was the only hoodie they had. I’m doing my part to support Pride. I bought all the Under Armour stuff found too. I found out that I love rainbows and I’m a sucker for it. I almost bought a Coach purse and then I decided that was a little ridiculous.
We talked last time about our Shannon Curtis concert coming up.
You guys are being really shy about joining us for this.
When we did the house concert, we had a lot of the same concerns for people at first. Then everybody that came had positively loved it.
It’s such a special experience. I wish that I could relay to people how special this is. It’s a magical moment. Shannon has this way of capturing your heart with her music. She is such a genuinely good person, and that comes across both when she talks to you and in her music.
I like the shows in terms of it’s not just she plays songs for 45 minutes or something. There’s typically an overarching theme and almost a storytelling aspect to it as well. That I think is really cool.
If you’re having trouble understanding what’s going to happen, picture this. You’re going to log in to a Zoom call. We’re going to have a few minutes where we all chat. We’re just like, “Who’s on?” and introduce ourselves a little bit. Then Shannon will start playing and singing. Her husband, Jamie, will be doing a little background musician thing. You’ll see them on Zoom. They won’t see you at that point. We will all just see Shannon and Jamie. It’s not going to be focused on you the whole time. Then we all enjoy this beautiful music that they put together. At the end of it, we get to chat a little bit more.
Hang out with a regular little Zoom call. It will be totally fun.
I want you guys to be there. You’re going to miss out. I’m telling you, it’s something so special. If you’re on the fence at all or you think, “I don’t know if I like that music,” just give it a try.
All-for-one rides are happening.
You remember these, right? No, I can tell. There are a lot of new people.
I know the name but I don’t remember what they are.
This is the special event that happens every year for the last three years. All of the instructors for a specific discipline teach the class together. All of the cycle instructors come together to teach a cycle class. All of the Tread instructors come together to teach a Tread class. All of the yoga instructors come together to teach yoga class. Last year 2019, they were all done on-demand and it sounds like this will be done on-demand this year 2020 as well. I’ve had a lot of people ask me, “What is this going to look like?” In the past, they’ve had two instructors on screen at a time. It starts with one and halfway through the song, another instructor comes out. The next one comes in. I don’t know how they’re going to do it, but I would not be shocked if it’s never more than two people on screen at a time.
Maybe they even recorded these at different times because of social distancing. I don’t know. It also could be that New York has gotten better enough that they could film it with everybody together. I really don’t know the answer to that, but we will see soon. It’s going to be dropping on July 2nd. I’m not even sure how many classes there will be yet, if it will be just the three, if they’re going to do something else because the UK teams are participating this year. Does that mean there will be six all-for-one classes? I don’t know what they’re going to do, but I’m super excited to find out.
Peloton celebrated Juneteenth last Friday.
I’m going to tell you, if you did not get a chance to take any of these classes, please do so. I took a class with Chase that completely blew my mind. He did an entire history lesson while running. First of all, just to be able to have the physical ability to teach while running, let’s give him kudos for that. He also made it interesting. The music that he put together with the actual background of what he was talking about was amazing. It was powerful. It told a story. He used the entire class to tell a freaking story. It was art. It was a moving meditation. It was fantastic. I have heard the same things, blowing recommendations from the ride with Tunde and The Flow with Chelsea. If you miss those, please make sure you check them out.
Joining us are Greg Hoskins and Crissie McDowell. Spoiler alert, they’re engaged and scheduled to be married in August 2020, finger crossed. It’s fingers crossed because of COVID, not because I questioned, just to be clear. I’m not questioning.
I was like, “Tom, where are you going with this?” Hopefully, appearing on our show doesn’t make them change direction. This will be an interesting interview for us because you guys are a couple, and Tom and I are a couple. You guys have a Peloton, but you also have FightCamp. There are a lot of workout variables happening here. Let’s start with the Peloton side since it’s a Peloton show. How did you guys originally come across Peloton?
Peloton is my half of the exercise equipment. I heard about it for years. To be honest, I always hated cycling. I used to take cycling classes and I did not enjoy it at all. At the end of the Christmas break, I decided it was time to kick my butt into high gear. I ordered it on the drive back from our Christmas trip after feeling full of a lot of cookies. I have a lot of friends that are pretty obsessed with it, so I just dove all in.
I have a question that I was previously not damaging your relationship, but I’m going to ask one. Ordering it the day after Christmas, is this a comment on the quality of gifts received?
Absolutely not. I had eight hours in a car and a lot of time for research.
You’re like, “Screw it, I’m doing it.”
It was mine by the time we got home.
Tell us about how FightCamp came into your life.
It’s the same story. I ordered it as a Christmas gift for myself back in December of 2018.
Do you both use both products or one of you only uses Peloton and one of you only uses FightCamp? How does it work in your house?
Like Crissie where she started to hate biking, I continue to hate biking. I don’t jump on the bike. I primarily use FightCamp. I’ve tried to talk her to get into that a little bit. She keeps telling me she will try it, but she hasn’t tried it yet. As far as my Peloton, I use the streaming app to do strength training and some of the HIIT stuff.
You use their different exercises. You’re not into the cycling portion of it. You use the other content that they have. How about you, Crissie? Do you just use the Peloton Bike or do you use other content that they have?
No. I love all the other content. I love it all.
You’re all in on the Peloton side.
I’m all in. I’ve been impressed with it. I got sick in February and had to take a little break, so I have not been the best Peloton user, but I began to love cycling. I ordered all the cute workout clothes. I love it.
Do these pieces of equipment reside in the same area or do you have to give them separate?
No, they couldn’t be farther apart. They’re on two different floors.
This is where? I’m picturing a man cave.
I’ve got a man corner in the back garage. I have the FightCamp, workout stuff, some weights and a TV to stream all the workouts too. The Peloton is upstairs in our loft.
I want to hang out with the kids while they do it
You guys never work out together?
Absolutely not. We went for a jog once.
She stopped and went back and I kept going. Working out together isn’t our own thing.
We’re teasing, but that’s not the worst thing. It’s good to have some time to yourself. That’s not a character flaw.
One of the reasons we don’t work out together is Greg does it at 5:30 in the morning and I am sleeping.
I’m an early morning worker outer.
That’s pretty early.
Is that because of your work schedule to get it done before work or is that you just always work out that time?
It’s been in that routine for a pretty long time. At the end of the workday, I’m so exhausted that I wouldn’t do it, so I got to get myself out of bed. I jump out of bed, get ready, and go do it. It’s not that big of a deal. I don’t think I could do it at night.
Were you doing something prior to FightCamp?
I’ve done a lot of the at-home workout like Beachbody stuff. I’ve done a lot of those workouts. I was looking for something different. Honestly, I used to some kickboxing classes at the Y years ago. Those are always my favorite workouts because you get to punch and kick stuff. When I heard about FightCamp, I did my research, read all the reviews and went on the Facebook page. I got super excited, pulled the trigger and haven’t looked back. It’s been awesome.
I heard you say kickboxing classes. Does that mean you taking the kickboxing classes on FightCamp or do you do the regular boxing classes a mixture? What kind of content do you use?
I do a mix. It wasn’t too long ago that they came out with some of their kickboxing workouts. At first, I was like, “No, I want to stick with the boxing stuff.” I decided to throw on one of the kickboxing workouts and I can’t get enough of it. I actually did one. I’m super excited when they add new workouts to incorporate the kicks too.
I haven’t taken any of the kickboxing classes. You have your gloves whenever you punch, but you don’t have any shin guards. One, is there anything to track it? Two, does it hurt your legs whenever you’re punching or kicking the bag?
It would have hurt your legs if you had poor form, but they do a good job going through the techniques and teaching you the proper way to kick. There are no trackers for legs at least. As you’re doing kicks, that’s mixed in with the punching. It doesn’t register those.
You’re only fooling yourself. If you’re not doing them like that, then why are you even taking the class? It’s like boxing.
Exercise is equivalent of a take a penny, leave a penny.
It’s added just another dynamic to the workouts. I find myself even more winded when all the kicks are involved too. It’s been awesome.
I bet it’s even more of a full body workout at that point. Is that your favorite thing about FightCamp or do you have something different that draws you in? What are your thoughts on that?
All the other different streaming workouts and things that I’ve done before, it’s non-contact. You’re lifting weights and you’re doing Plyometrics and doing all this stuff. With FightCamp, you get to punch stuff, you get to kick stuff, and it’s an awesome stress reliever. It definitely wakes you up first thing in the morning. All the workers that they have are different. All the trainers are totally different, have a different way of approaching their workouts. The variety of the content, the trainers, and music. It’s been great. That’s awesome.
I think that FightCamp should come out with a bag where there’s an 8×10 frame in it where you can slide in a picture of someone you don’t like.
That would give me a little bit extra motivation.
It could be one of those lenticular things. He used to give different faces, smiling. If you punch it, it shifts. When FightCamp does that, they owe me $20.
We’ll go ask them for that. Crissie, how about you for Peloton? What is your favorite part about Peloton?
I love the equipment. To be honest, I love the screen. I love the interactivity with other people. You can see where you are ranking. I’m usually in the bottom 3%. We’re working on that, but it’s a nice piece of equipment. The classes are amazing. They’re motivating. I started to love cycling, which I didn’t think was possible.
You didn’t think it was possible, but you bought one.
I find that interesting too.
I’ve got a wedding to get ready for.
You were like, “I have a very specific goal in mind.” You were thinking, “If I don’t like it, I can always sell it afterwards.”
Honestly, the expense of it, I knew I would have to use it. I’m required. I can’t just give up on it like I would any use old streaming class.
There is a certain guilt factor that makes you. How great is it that you don’t do it because you feel guilty? You do it because you enjoy it.
My kids have even started to get on it too. They have a ton of fun with it. It’s pretty cute.
Had you done stuff prior to Peloton or was that you jumped in feet first to exercise?
I would say I jumped in feet first before. I need group motivation for me. I’m not like Greg where I can just do anything streaming. I feel Peloton is group motivation, and they’re such good resources online, the groups. I’ve done Pure Barre classes. Anything streaming I was not super successful with.
Why do you think Peloton is different for you?
It feels like a group workout to me.
I can totally see that. It’s very engaging.
I love the instructors.
Do you have a favorite?
Cody’s amazing dance moves.
Have you taken any of his cardio dance class?
No. Is it amazing?
You need to check that out. That’s a lot of fun. I think it was him and Emma doing that one. It was so much fun.
I love that. I am going to try that.
For FightCamp, you said you had done things like Beachbody. Greg, you’re clearly self-disciplined and self-motivated when it comes to workouts. You’re like, “I can go do this thing.” FightCamp is different than Beachbody because there’s always new content coming out. It’s motivating in a very different way.
I usually do FightCamps 3 to 4 times a week. I’ll stream one of the Peloton Strength for HIIT workouts three-ish times a week. For FightCamp, you’re right. They’re always coming out with new stuff. I find myself lying in bed at night, going through the app, “Which work will I do tomorrow morning?” It’s all set and ready to go. It’s exciting to have new workouts because with the other kind of strength workouts you buy a DVD set or you stream it online, it’s just those workouts for a particular program. They’re adding new content and new workouts finding new ways to add different elements like the kicks. It keeps me very excited.
If she ever gets you to try the Peloton, don’t punch it. It sounds like that’s a big selling point for you. Honestly, I’m trying to get you to be selfish on your own behalf. They’re not cheap. If you damage it, she’s going to expect you to buy another one.
That’s true. I don’t think that’s covered under warranty.
I’m pretty sure it’s not.
I can’t fit into her shoes. As long as we don’t buy new shoes, then I’m golden.
Also they have the cages, so you could always ride with the cages. I know Tom doesn’t like to exercise in general.
I’m just flat out lazy.
If you like to exercise, I’m a little perplexed. You don’t like the biking at all, none of it. Have you tried a scenic ride? I’ve talked to people who like to kind of do their own thing, which it sounds like you do. It sounds like you might like that aspect of it.
Crissie keeps trying to talk me into it like I keep trying to talk her into doing some FightCamp. I’ll be honest, it was a few years ago that I went to a spin class with one of my friends. I found out that it was not for me, so because of that one class, I’ve had this mental block on biking.
I don’t know. That was long ago. It’s nothing genetic or anything. It’s the same thing with mountain biking. We live in Boise where there’s mountain biking everywhere. I would prefer to take a ski lift up a mountain and get down the hill zooming through single tracks versus biking up hill.
We need to do some more research here because I’m not a big mountain biker. First of all, mountain biking is terrifying. You have to have a lot of technical skills for that.
Yes. We don’t have those in Missouri. We have big hills.
We have the Ozark mountains, but it’s not real mountains. Let’s not kid ourselves.
It’s not like we’re looking at the Rockies or anything. That’s different than the Peloton. The Peloton is you get on, you have a great ride with your friends, you’re hanging out and it’s like a party. You’re still working out. It’s different.
I’ll bet Greg would love it if he tried it.
I feel Greg squirming. I feel he’s like, “I don’t like this conversation. I don’t like where this is going. I don’t like anything about this.” You guys need to switch workouts for half-an-hour one day because Crissie, you would like the FightCamp. It’s so much fun to beat the crap out of something. You’ve got to get frustrated about something sometimes.
With the kids, schooling and stuff, it’s a good time for that.
I’m telling you that feels pretty good to punch something real hard.
Like a Sadie Hawkins dance.
I would be excited to see the end results of that.
I will try it.
It almost sounds like I called him beforehand and gave him tips. Here’s where his FightCamp training comes in. He’s gotten very good at the duck and weave.
You catch a lot of things, Tom
That will come in handy the longer you’re married. I assure you.
As far as FightCamp goes, who are your favorite instructors on FightCamp?
They’re all different in their own ways, but I would say Shanie Smash. She’s awesome. Their energy level is out the way out there. It’s great.
I liked Coach PJ too. Out of all the workouts, he seems to have a lot of the most technical ones in terms of the combinations that he throws at you. There’s a lot to remember and technically perform. I like that aspect from all his workouts.
I haven’t had a chance to take a class with him yet. That’s something to put in the old memory bank to try out. I’ve been on the prospect path. I’m working my way through it slowly.
They have a prospect path and they also have a kickboxing path where they introduce you to adding kicks in. They have the same type of progression they do with the prospect path. You should check that out too.
I feel like I need to finish one before I move to the other. Maybe I can switch gears. I don’t know. I’m excited to try the kickboxing. If punching feels great, how good can kicking something feel? Tom’s like, “I don’t know about this.”
Tom, what are you doing when she’s jumping on the bike or beating the crap out of the bag?
I’m probably watching TV or sleeping. She gets up early.
Do you guys focus on the leaderboards at all on either? FightCamp has a leaderboard, but it’s static. You see it at the end. Peloton has a leaderboard. Do you guys use those at all?
I completely do. I have to filter it down. I’m in the real low ranks there. I try to filter it down to a pretty specific range, so I feel better about myself.
I get that. If I’m close to 50%, I feel good. I’m like, “Okay, I did good.”
I’m trying to fight with the people closest to me.When you’re just starting on Peloton, start with the super short beginner classes and don’t beat yourself up about it. Click To Tweet
I think that’s fair. I know that you’re couching that as you feel that’s not. There are legitimate professional athletes that are using Peloton. A regular human being is not going to be able to beat it.
Regular NFL football players, NBA basketball players, Olympians, and then there’s me. Every bike is so different. Fifty on your bike might be easy compared to my bike or vice versa. You might also have a very hard bike.
I’m sure I do.
Greg, your bag might be tougher. Every once in a while, they send out one that’s entirely filled with concrete. For the sake of clarity, they don’t do that.
It would be a lot harder to ship. Do you use the leaderboard for a FightCamp at all?
After every workout, I’ll look to see where I ranked. Sometimes it’s high, sometimes it’s slow. There’s so much stuff in there in content, I don’t think I’ve ever repeated any workouts. I can’t go back and try to move up the ranking or anything. I’ll look after each workout and mentally tell myself I did awesome or that I sucked and then I’ll move on.
That’s what I do for both. I do that for Peloton and FightCamp. It’s like, “That’s how I did.”
I have another great idea for the FightCamp bag. This is almost as good as by lenticular headshot idea. It’ll sell more bags. It bruises. When you get it all the way bruised, you got to buy another one.
They do wear out. I’ve been punching and kicking for a long time and they’re starting to wear out. There are marks everywhere. I haven’t cleaned it either.
Being all white, it picks up anything over time.
It’s just normal wear and tear definitely.
As much as I like to hit things, I’m glad you have this item in your house.
So are my kids when they’re trying to sleep at 5:30.
Ours is in the basement, so I don’t think anybody hears me using it. All I know is I always beat the number of punches. I don’t know how hard they are, but I’m getting the number.
That’s one of the first comments that I made at least about the Peloton. I was surprised how quiet it is.
I will say that if you ever look into getting a treadmill and you’re thinking the same thing, the treadmill is not as quiet as the bike. I don’t think it’s possible to make a treadmill as quiet as the bike because it has a motor and the bike doesn’t, so that would be different. The bike is amazingly quiet. Many people have it in their bedroom right next to their bed. When they get out of bed, the other person in the relationship will be sleeping. They’ll do a ride right there.
That’s crazy. I believe it though. It’s like a whisper. Our kids are right outside of the loft and they never hear a thing.
Do you take classes with headphones on or do you keep them off so they can hear the music? How do you work that?
I do headphones because if I’m upstairs either with the kids and they’re watching TV and I’m annoying them or they’re sleeping and I’m trying to be quiet.
I know some of the music choices aren’t always child-friendly. They get you going. They get you all pumped up. Are Cody’s music choices your favorite music choices? Is that one of the reasons he’s one of your go-tos?
No, I like Ally’s music choices better, but I love his dance moves.
I always enjoy hearing people’s pairings of instructors because people go in grouping. If you’re a Cody and an Ally, you also probably like Robin. You might shy away from Christine or a Matt Wilper’s technical rides.
This is correct. You’re accurate.
This is my psychology of Peloton in motion. I’m developing it every time. I absolutely needed to be fun. Personally, I will gravitate towards somebody like Jenn Sherman, but I might throw in like a Robin on days whenever I need somebody to yell at me in a good way. A motivating yelling, not like she’s talking down to me. Everybody has those days where you’ve got to get pumped up and need somebody else to do it.
What is your leaderboard name on the bike?
Mine’s Crissie Missy. Don’t judge me. I don’t have too many rides under my belt.
How many boxing classes do you have under your leaderboard name, Greg?
I would have to look it up. I’ve been going strong since December of 2018. With her trying to get in shape to go on to Thailand, that’s right when I first got it. I was doing it every single day. I’ve thrown hundreds of thousands of punches. I can tell you that.
What about on FightCamp? I have a quick question. You mentioned going to Thailand. You’re the third person I’ve heard mentioned Thailand. What’s going on in Thailand? I always think of it as so far away and all of a sudden, I’ve heard multiple people mention Thailand.
As a vacation destination.
I’m just curious, why Thailand? It’s far away.
You eat your way through Thailand.
Are you kidding? That would be a waste of time. He would be like, “Where are the chicken tenders?”
How long did it take you to get to Thailand?
It’s a long time. We went from Boise to Seattle, to Seoul and to Chiang Mai. The final destination was Chiang Mai. With all the flights and layovers, it was 27 hours with the layover. When we got to Seoul, it was an eight-hour layover
It wasn’t that bad though. It didn’t feel as terrible as you would expect.
That sounds pretty terrible. I’m not going to lie.
How long were you there for?
We split up our trip when we got to Thailand. We were in Chiang Mai, which is a town in Northern Thailand for roughly five days. We went down to Phuket for another five.
Did you take the kids with you?
No, this was just a Crissie and Greg trip.
It was affordable and super hot over there, which was perfect. The water was 80 degrees in the ocean.
When you get there, it’s a resort-type vacation?
Phuket definitely was. In Chiang Mai, I’d found a bed and breakfast right in the center of where all their night markets are and stuff. Everything is incredibly cheap there. We got this penthouse, top floor bed and breakfast for the equivalent of $45 a night. The people are amazing. They’re friendly. Their food is incredible. The scenery is out of this world. It’s really safe. We could have brought the kids, but we just wanted to take a trip.
We take vacations without the kids too. We take it with the kids as well. I think it’s smart.
We are on board with it. We do at least one trip a year without the kids.
Years ago, we took the kids to Disneyland and we had planned on doing that again. That’s not going to happen.
We had trips. We had five things planned. Everything has been canceled.
We were supposed to go take the kids to Hawaii.
That’s canceled. We were going to go to Mexico.
What are you going to do? First world problems.
We’re alive. We’re safe. We’re healthy. That’s all the important stuff.
Greg, what’s your leaderboard name on FightCamp?
How did you come up with that?
It just came to me. It came to me in my sleep.
Is there an underscore or a dot?
No, just one valid word.
That’s a lot of ingenuity.
Crissie will be changing her leaderboard name.
Crissie, we all want to know what’s it going to be?
What are you going to do?
I will change my name there.
In Facebook and Instagram?
In real life.
Do you guys have any advice for people starting their workout journeys through FightCamp or Peloton?
Don’t be a Tom.
How was that the first time anybody’s ever said that?
I don’t know. It’s a good question. They just assumed if you were already listening to the podcasts, you already went past Tom.
I set the bar pretty low.
I had to watch a lot of YouTube videos to figure out how to even clip in and out of the bike. My advice would be to start with the super short beginner classes and not beat yourself up about it. Try to stay consistent.
That’s a great advice.
With FightCamp, I think it’s just diving in. I’m pretty sure Peloton does. FightCamp still do a money back guarantee thing. Even if you did it and you found out you didn’t like it, at least you tried it. I guarantee if you get it, you’re not going to stop. It’s very addicting.
I definitely agree with that for both pieces of equipment. They’re tons of fun. I don’t know how you could not use them, Tom.
It’s pretty easy, but it’s the best way to box because it can’t punch back.
That could be iteration to here. You never know.
Could you make one with the frame it bruises and it punches back?
Would you be in, Tom? Are you all in that?
No. Why would I want something that could punch me back?
Before we go, where can people find you on the interwebs if you would like to be found?
My Instagram is @Greg__Hoskins. Facebook is just Greg Hoskins.
I’m so creative too. My Instagram is @CrissieMcD, same as my Peloton.
You guys are being consistent. If you’re going to start a brand, you’ve already got a big part of it down.
Thank you so much for taking time out of your busy schedules to join us. We appreciate it.
It was fun chatting with you, guys.
I’m ready to get on the bike again.
I’m still not going to. Maybe I’m getting a little bit closer. We’ll see.
Good luck. We’re keeping our fingers crossed for you.
We appreciate that.
I know a lot of people are trying to get married. My niece, they’re getting married.
She’s having the same kind of freak out about, “Are we going to be able to all gather in the places that we had expected to?”
Thank you very much.
You guys stay safe and healthy.
That brings this one to an end. What do you have in store for people next episode?
The longest interview in progress. What I mean by that is this is the longest time I have spent trying to get somebody on the show. We are going to talk to Steven Little.
We should probably explain for newer Pelotoner. He was a Peloton instructor that was very popular. Then he and Peloton parted ways and people were very upset. He’s been fairly radio silent for a while. He’s going to come on and talk about what he’s been up to and where you can find him now and what he has planned for the future.
It’s good to hear all the good information right here.
Until next time, where can people find you?
People can find me at Facebook.com/CrystalDOKeefe. They can find me on Instagram, Twitter, on the Bike and of course the Tread, @ClipOutCrystal.
You can find me on Twitter, @RogerQBert or on Facebook at Facebook.com/TomOKeefe. You can find the show online at Facebook.com/TheClipOut. While you’re there, like the page, join the group. Wherever you’re getting your podcast from, be sure and subscribe, so you’ll never miss an episode. That’s it for this one. Thanks for tuning in. Until next time, keep pedaling and running.
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